Kermit & Miss Piggy: The Ideal Couple?
BFDude Matt saw Nick and Norah’s Infinite Playlist this weekend, and wrote in with some observations about the film. (I love his reference to Kermit and Miss Piggy; I totally related to them back in high school.)
Hi Monique, something I noticed while watching Nick & Norah tonight that might be BFD related.
Kat Dennings is bigger than Michael Cera.
Barely and it’s mostly due to Cera being tiny than Kat being big, but I still thought it was unique for a mainstream film. Besides Roger & Jessica Rabbit and Kermit & Miss Piggy, I can’t really think of on screen couples where the guy is thinner. Even in classic Hollywood, when actress had hips, the men all had broad shoulders to offset them. Nowadays the shoulders are still broad even as the hips disappeared.
In the film Norah’s a tiny bit insecure because her rival is a stereotypical model type, but the script never reinforces her insecurities, instead giving other characters every chance to declare her beautiful.
Anyway, as a thin guy who adores round women, it’s not often I even see a hint of my “ideal couple” reflected on screen, so I thought I’d bring it up.
I saw the movie this weekend myself and was also struck by what Matt’s saying, especially the part of his e-mail that I bolded above. Norah’s insecurity is definitely in part weight-based; Norah makes several references to being unable to compete with Tris because she’s super thin, and in the trailer, she delivers the line, “I could floss with that girl.” I love that this insecurity is portrayed as ridiculous (because, of course, Kat Dennings is a beautiful girl) by all the other characters in the film.
Certainly Kat Dennings is not overweight, but she isn’t one of the Shanae Grimes-esque, uber-thin actresses we’re seeing so much of lately, either. And in a movie aimed at a young adult audience, it’s a body positive message that I appreciated seeing.
Posted by mo pie
Filed under: Celebrities, Fat Positive, Feminism, Media, Movies
On That ’70s Show, Donna is clearly more robust than Eric. Weezie is bigger than George in The Jeffersons. And Betty Suarez could probably snap Henry Grubstick like a, well, a grubstick. But you’re right, it’s not that common and I’m always happy when I see reverse sexual dimorphism on tv.
But Kermit and Miss Piggy…..not an ideal relationship. Interspecial love is wrong. And Kermit never seems particularly happy that Piggy is in love with him. She deserves better.
I always think of Sookie and Jackson on Gilmore Girls. Jackson wasn’t skinny, but Sookie was definitely bigger than him, and her weight was never even mentioned on the show, that I recall, and they certainly never showed him having an issue with it. Same with Babette and Maury, who was super skinny while she was big and busty.
Aw, sniff, I loved that show! I miss it!
“…I can’t really think of on screen couples where the guy is thinner. Even in classic Hollywood, when actress had hips, the men all had broad shoulders to offset them.”
Well, there was Fred Astaire, with his various leading ladies, most of whom were dancers. But apart from him, I can’t think of many thin-man/bigger-woman movie couples either.
This just put me in mind of the pregnancy books I read where, in the “clothing” chapter, they advised me that I could just wear my husband’s shirts when I started to show. I know plenty of women who wouldn’t be able to use that tip (and even more who have some fashion sense and simply wouldn’t if they could, plus-sized or not).
@Quiconque – Piggy deserves better? Hey, I always thought Kermit deserved better!!
Ma and Pa Kettle.
Great point. I saw the movie (which is well-made and entertaining besides) this weekend and didn’t even notice the size difference…maybe because the script doesn’t really draw attention to it.
Yes, they form a lovely couple, but let’s be honest, do you really want to be bigger than your guy? I like my men to have broad shoulders and be taller than me. I think most women want guys to be bigger and most guys want women to be smaller than them, thus the preference most men have for small women, and women for tall or muscular guys.
I read the book, and my vision of the two characters was not exactly how they’re portrayed in the movie.. But hooray for a girl being just a tad meatier (and it not translating to top-heavy) than her guy!!!!
Alexis– I would love to find a guy who’s bigger and taller than me. (Un)Fortunately, I’m 6ft even and weight 260 lbs. And I’m actually attracted to lanky, skater-punk guys who I could pick up and carry around.. don’t know why. But, as a result of my size, the guys that I do wind up with have never been bigger than me; we’re usually comparable in size, which is ok.
I do long for a guy who’s taller than me by about 6 inches, but that’s mainly so I can wear my assorted collection of way-too-high-heels and still be shorter than my partner. Instead I get guys who are comfortable with being seen with a Glamazon, and that’s an awesome ego-stroke.
When I think of Kermit and Miss Piggy, I think of them in A Muppet Christmas Carol, or Muppet Treasure Island— where they like each other pretty much equally. I think they’re great together.
Also, the show My Wife and Kids– the wife is bigger than Damon Waynes’ character.
Alexis- my guy does happen to be taller than me, but I do outweigh him by a good 50 pounds. My shoulders are broader than his too, my wrists are bigger and his hands are only slightly larger than mine. It’s not a big deal. I guess it’s not a big deal because my mom is bigger than my dad. Mom is 5’6″ and robust, dad is 5’2″ and one of those small skinny guys. There was never a fuss made about it and my mom even wore high heels, back when her feet would allow her to.
Alexis – I’m dating a tall, lanky, knobbly-kneed wonderful nerd that I could easily take. I like it. And he likes that he’s dating a short, plump amazon. Really it’s all about who you wind up in love with. *shrug* Preferences and such.
That said, I really loved this movie. It was great to see a couple that was quirky and not really like the typical Hollywood “perfect couple”.
Alexis- Not only am I bigger than my husband in the sense that I weigh more, I’m also taller than him by an inch.
He likes that I’m taller and bigger…it’s a turn on for him…and he’s not bad in the looks department himself.
He does have broad shoulders though as he is physically athletic…but…other then that he’s not the sterotypical taller man.
And honestly…looking a guy in the eye is very intimate
Donna & Eric, Sookie & Jackson and Babette & Maury! Thanks Quiconque and Sarah, I knew I was forgetting some great couples. I love those shows but they both lost me in their last seasons which fuzzied my memory a bit.
Alexis – my fiance is exactly one inch taller than me (he’s 5’3″, I’m 5’2″) – we are both short and skinny, but I probably outweigh him by about 15lb due to the fact that I do cross-country running and cycling (yay muscle!) while he sits in a lab all day being a brilliant scientist.
He is also, I hardly need to add, the most beautiful man in the world in my opinion :D And being able to swap clothes with each other is just a bonus!
Alexis, the preference for small women has a lot to do with men’s insecurities about women becoming powerful. At best, a guy who wants only smaller women has security issues and needs the reassurance of his physical prowess to prop up his ego. At worst, it’s the sign of a scary abusive mindset, a man who prefers less powerful women has domination/control issues.
So I don’t mind being the bigger one in the relationship (though he’s still almost a head taller than I). I’d rather not worry about what “most men” prefer, I’m certainly not going to try to conform to a system that favors powerlessness in women to please men in general.
My boyfriend is taller than me by about 5 inches, but I am definitely bigger than him. He is one of those skinny gamers that even when he wears a big bulky sweatshirt still looks skinny, while I have rounds hips, stomach, thighs, etc.
He loves it that way, and so do I.
I haven’t seen the movie yet, but it’s nice to see a couple that isn’t stereotypical hollywood. And a girl who is young and not uber skinny or itty bitty.
I think in a lot of young adult couples the woman must be a least a little bit bigger than the guy, simply because a lot of guys don’t start broadening out or finish growing until they’re in their 20s.
I’ve met a lot of attractive guys who I totally out weigh, and it’s not that big a deal. I’ve also met guys who outweigh me who are attractive. And the height varies as well…
I think what Alexis points out is also not just about guys or girls insecurities, but also shows just what we’re supposed to idealize as our perfect match. Men “should” be bigger, women “should” be smaller. But I think to each their own.
Whoa, GodlessHeathen, that’s kinda harsh. My husband is 6 inches taller than me, and a good 75lbs heavier (he’s 5’8 and 190lbs, I’m 5’2 and 115lbs), and yes, he DOES prefer women to be smaller and shorter than him. However, I don’t see how that preference makes him at best, insecure and ego-driven, and at worst, an abuser. Because he is the most wonderful, kind, loving, sweet, and fantastic guy to ever exist. Yes, he only wants shorter and thinner women, but so? I only want taller and heavier (not fat though) guys, what does that make me? Besides, *I* am the dominant one in the relationship…I always have been, and I probably always will be. His preferences don’t make him a bad person, or a potential abuser, misogynist, or control freak.
Another example is that I am white, and only want white men. Does that make me racist? Does it make me sexist because I would never want a woman? Is a gay man sexist because he refuses to date women? I hope you see what I’m getting at…because preferences are what they are, and I really don’t think people need yet ANOTHER thing to obsess and feel guilt over. If you like a particular type of person sexually, why shouldn’t you go with it? Should you have to try and force yourself to want someone that you have no attraction to or desire for? I’m not trying to be combative or anything, I am honestly curious about this, and I hope you all take this the way it was meant…just honest curiosity and not mean-spirited or attacking.
Oh, I forgot to mention that this only applies to sexual preferences. I don’t care what color, race, religion, gender, weight, etc., you are…I will be friends with anyone (as long as they aren’t jerks, of course!). But sexual relationships, and desire, is something totally different, at least to me. Everyone has friends that they love to death, yet they have no physical attraction to or desire to have sex or an emotional/physical intimate relationship with, so I hope you all see what I’m getting at, but I just wanted to clarify my comment a little more.
Also, I am not saying that fat cannot be attractive, or that anyone is wrong for finding it so…I respect everyone’s preferences, even when I am not included in them. I am just saying that certain things are not MY thing. Viva la
difference, right?
PS- I really enjoy this blog, and I think you guys have a lot of really intelligent stuff to say. You’ve given me a lot to think about, and a lot to learn. Thanks for (hopefully) putting up with me, and (extra-hopefully!) being nice if I’ve said anything too desperately stupid.
My beloved is taller than me, but like most people here, I probably outweigh him. Neither of us seem to mind – in fact he got quite worried when I lost weight in the spring (glandular fever), and was encouraging towards my efforts to put it back on, because he didn’t think I looked healthy.
I like slender guys. Big burly men with massive shoulders are not appealing to me.
Oddly matched couples always put me in mind of my grandparents: he was 5’4″ and maybe 135 after a really big meal; she was 5’10” and shading 300, with a knock-out set of legs. When they were photographed together, she was always sitting down. Whatever – it must have worked for them, as they had 6 children and a 50-year marriage.
Just keep in mind: what looks a little outre to you is someone else’s idea of absolute perfection.
And by the by: Someone is NOT “larger than me”; it’s “larger than I”. Where WERE you all during those 6th grade grammar lessons?
“because preferences are what they are, and I really don’t think people need yet ANOTHER thing to obsess and feel guilt over.”
PlasticSpoon, I agree that people do often have specific physical preferences in terms of sexual attraction…but I disagree that those preferences don’t deserve to be examined and looked at carefully. I don’t think that we’re just born with a specific set of preferences, I think they come from somewhere; and it’s worth exploring how they got there. And when you say you would never want to date a fat man, and that you’d never want to date a non-white man, I don’t think those are just meaningless things — I think they do in fact say something about you. I’m saying what they say about you, I’m just saying that I think someone’s preferences are not just neutral, and it’s worth looking at them more deeply.
On a personal note, I have the most respect for men who can be (and have been) attracted to all different types of women. I appreciate people who can truly see and realize beauty in all kinds of different forms. Also, I am white, and I would have a really hard time wanting to date a guy of any race who said there were certain races he wouldn’t date. It just seems like too big a clash in values.
PlasticSpoon-I would also point out that there’s a difference between a preference and a flat out rule like “I could never date a woman bigger than me” I mean, most of us have met and been attracted to people who don’t meet our original preference ideals, yes? Also, since you seem defensive of your husband let me point out-a social system/structure can be bad without individual people being bad-in other words, yes, those preferences of your husbands DO reflect a misogynist system, even if he isn’t a misogynist himself(I am don’t think he is). Godless Heathen is spot on about the trend, even if every individual man doesn’t think that way.
I don’t think Godless Heathen was harsh at all
And I admit to feeling really conflicted when people talk about not dating out of their race. On one level, I get that people have tastes and that attraction is complicated. But when someone tells me that they don’t find anyone who isn’t white attractive, something in my guy starts whispering “racist.”
I’m not saying I’m right. I’m saying that’s how I feel.
I’m a fat lesbian who has been dating a skinny butch latina for 13 years.
KB — thanks for your comment. I agree with what you wrote about the difference between a preference and a rule. Good call.
I only want taller and heavier (not fat though) guys, what does that make me?
It probably makes you someone who’s never happened to be attracted to anyone who falls outside your specified paradigms :D
“-a social system/structure can be bad without individual people being bad-in other words, yes, those preferences of your husbands DO reflect a misogynist system, even if he isn’t a misogynist himself”
So now I have another provocative question – can this system, which you say is misogynist, be changed? Or is it part of our genetic makeup? While individuals express a variety of preferences, forming partnerships that escape the rule, could it be that they will always be the exceptions?
A nature versus nurture question, basically, and maybe unanswerable!